View Full Version : 3D programs

07-27-2001, 05:25 PM
Hi, I am very interested in #D programs and applying it into Flash, I already know Swift 3D but I was wondering if someone could give me a list or a couple of really good 3D programs.. I also know that there is alot to learn about 3D programs but I am very interested in 3D... Thanks

07-28-2001, 03:10 AM
Hello Diesel!

Vecta3D Max is great! if you know 3D studio max you'll find this program very impressive tool for Flash import.....



07-30-2001, 01:19 PM
Hey thanks alot for the reply, I will check that out. Thanks again...

08-06-2001, 02:03 PM
Hi Diesel...

The one NoRain refered is good, 3DS Max is very good too.

But people here talks also about Swift3D, I've never tried it personally, but they say it's fine...

Hope it helps.

See ya

08-07-2001, 06:07 AM
from what i saw at Flashforward, Amorphium Pro looks like an awesome 3d program and seems easy to use, i dont remember the company that makes it, but it is a good buy.

09-04-2001, 12:27 AM
amorphium pro is pretty good,
considering that you have an extra 512 MB memory.

theys say 128 MB is enough, that is if you have a
lot of time to waste.

anyway, it is indeed handy to use...


09-05-2001, 04:44 AM
I'm using Swift3D.....took me about 30 minutes to learn it, and it's excellent for all my 3D needs so far...
I've also heard good things about Amorphium Pro.

10-02-2001, 05:56 PM
Well, with 3D you probably have to think about budget too. 3D Studio MAX is great and everything, if you have like $ 3000,- for a lite package, but fortunately there's also the lite version QMAX I believe. Designed for gamedevelopment. Since you'll probably only use it to model this is the better choice.

But if you intend to go far into 3D and you have money to spare (like $ 30,000,- or so for the light package and a computer with a minimum of 512 MB, 1280x1024 and preferably one of those new Quadro cards) ... try Maya. (steep learning curve, but hey, you' ll get something in return) Square (you know, the Final Fantasy guys) use Maya, so you know what it can do. The cheapest complete solution package would be Lightwave (still expensive though), which also has a beutiful renderer (unlike MAX. I used it at school. Its hard to make it look non-CG).

But for FLASH only stuff, stick to Swift3D. Its easy to learn and you can do all your Flash stuff with it. Plus, its not ridiculously overpriced like those complete solution packages ...

BTW Amorphium Pro sucks.

10-12-2001, 04:11 AM
I know one of the guys who works on the little segements on Toonami on the Cartoon Network (the one with the little robot guy). They use Maya too and he says it's quite awesome but expensive and requires an SG workstation or a dual proc PC at the minimum.

If you want to start small try Strata, it's free for a simple version (that can do a lot) and if you want to get more and more into it you can pay for better versions, plus they support the product well.

You get what you pay for but maybe you don't need that much.

10-12-2001, 06:20 AM
I use Maya 3 for lots of 3d modeling and animation work but would like to incorporate it somehow into flash now. I know max has lots of plugins to do this but how about in Maya. I know of a few shader options to give a toon like apparance but not anything to export in vector format. Any suggestions?

10-15-2001, 10:23 AM
I'm new here but I've used Flash and 3D programs quite a lot. It depends on what you want to do. If it's simply to output a rendered movie then go for the cheap solutions, Poser outputs in image sequences, import them into Flash. Both Max and Lightwave have exporters for Director 8.5, indirectly you can still use Poser cos Poser exports to either of these (with Poser Pro Pack installed) so you can set up a figure and via Max or Lightwave into Director 8.5. Then you've got a figure that you can pan around, eventually Poser will have a means of exporting in the .w3d format that Director uses, then it'll mean you'll be able to pan around an animation. Till then it's all a bit more basic. Swift just exports an image from the 3D packages in the native Flash format. You lose an awfull lot of detail, sometimes vector images are actually larger than the bitmap versions. So it's horses for courses. It's a really exciting area to get into though, experiment, have fun. Personally, I wouldn't go the Maya route, unless you're mega rich!

10-15-2001, 11:41 AM
yeah, besides, Flash and 3D isn't really great, unless you're not going to use textures and you're really fond of that shiny look. Like said before : What do you want to do with it ? (MAX and lightwave aren't cheap either, affordable, but still more expensive than most people's PC's / MACS)

10-16-2001, 08:24 PM
I have Max but I rarely use it because after using Maya I'll never go back again, maya's workflow is so much better and I can get through Maya 10x faster.

Actually I'm not into that whole rotating letter thing, seems kinda played to me. I want to somehow utilize real 3d in flash but maybe flash is the wrong tool for it. I want to create fully 3d and textured interfaces to use on the web. More of like a higher bandwidth version. Maya doesnt seem to have many export options available other than the typical .obj. Maya does cost 16,000 but its not mine, its the schools so no sweat off my back.

Most vector images that I see are really dull, single color or simple gradient. How about making a full 3d interface all textured and then converting the whole thing to vector somehow so it is a super detailed vector and you can't really tel betweeen rastor and vector too much? I need a wya to export from Maya to vector but super detailed. Bringing into flash a .tga or something and vector tracing it I dont think would work correctly.

I've seen a few websites that had lots of fully textured 3d elements in them and they looked really sweet. I can't remember the URL though, i've been lookin for it recently. I'd ask that guy if i could remember it.

10-16-2001, 11:09 PM
If an adult site doesn't offend, check this out:


It shows full textured 3D stuff.

10-18-2001, 02:03 PM
U can do all that with Director 8.5 If highbandwith isn't a prob, Director is your way to go. Lingo looks a lot like ActionScript and I belevie there's a free Maya plugin that exports to the Director format at http://www.macromedia.com/director . Anyway, since u use Maya, did u perhaps happen to have worked with MTOR ?

Other ways to get real 3D into the web is Cult3d or Nemo / Virtools (u can also make 3d games with Nemo / Virtools. Very good application)

10-18-2001, 11:57 PM
MTOR? Is it a person?

Yeha just found that 3d maya plug for director 8.5 other day. Also just found out that there is a Swiff plug for Maya that exports Maya 4 as a .swf. Does something with vecotr shaders i think. Not sure since I use maya 3 anyways.

I guess i'll have to play around with maya and director, i bleieve thats a better option than flash and CD based is more bandwidth friendly as long as the people have fast enough HD's and CDROMS. Once I finish my reel I guess I'll get started on that as well as learning more actionscripting and lingo.

10-19-2001, 12:12 PM
No, MTOR is a program, short for Maya to Renderman. If you feel Maya's renderer isn't real enough ... Then you can just do everything in Maya, like you're used to and then say to render to Renderman. Ofcourse it'll require the VERRRYYY expensive Renderman, but maybe your school can afford it (mine wouldn't, or couldn't).

What's your Demoreel about ?

10-19-2001, 09:10 PM
Ohhhhh yeah ok i remember now. MTOR and bluemoon rendering tools are two of the renderman utilities. Yeah I took a class on renderman a year and a half ago, I scripted some badass shaders and made this really cool leaf. Renderman I believe is like 5G's a license per year. I just really never got really good with it. If you saw the stuff our school just bought hardware and sotware wise its nuff to make a man drool, i did :)

My demoreel is my 3d work so i can get a job as a 3D modeler / animator. THe job market right now is really slow though with all movies n stuff being cut back due to 9-11 so im gonna be open and also look for jobs in graphic design, interactive, mutlimedia etc. Some of my work is on my portfolio site www.visim.com/portfolio

So whats your story, are you a 3d artist too?

10-26-2001, 11:16 AM
I learned a little 3D on school, but we've just started really ... anyway I'm making a demoreel myself, but am still choosing ... (I prefer MAX for modelling, but it's renderer is so ... ugly, I'm a totlal newbie to Maya, let alone Renderman (I'm NO programmer) so preferably I don't do anything in Maya ... yet. Anyway our computers aren't really up to the task of modelling/rendering in Maya (instead of Renderman, they'd better focus on 1 or 2 packages and spent the rest of the money on new hardware each year).

Anyway, I'm more of a traditional 2D artist, specializing in human anatomy (well ... really more human exteriors, but that sounds so ... juvenile). Impressive portfolio BTW (too bad u don't have movieclips yet ... I'd like to see u're animations) How far is u're reel, development wise ? (what school did u attend anyway ?)

11-08-2001, 02:06 AM
Well lets see it depends where you want to work. I am having trouble finding maya jobs right now because it is more used in high end work which almost all places require years of real world EXP. Max is used in almost any gaming company and therefore lets you get more entry level jobs. If you can use both, I hate max so i refuse to use it. Most of the time anyways if you doing rendering you wont use the normal renderer, in gaming you use engines, and with movies and such you use either things such as renderman or programs designed in house.

I know exactly what your saying in human anatomy, thats good, specially in character design. Actually any drawing skills are GREAT, you'd be surprised how many ppl at an art school cant draw!! Thanks for the kind words bout the portfolio, yeah havnet had time with movie clips and such. Im attempting to learn quarkXpress, javascript, actionscripting as well as possibly asp and lingo in future argh!!!! I hate how in order to get a good job you need programming cuz im slow at it.

My reel is done as its gonna be until i get my own outputting machine at home so i can update it more. Until then its at a standstill. It has come a long way though but many places that I wanted to go require max exp which i just dont have. I went to SCAD, savannah college of art and design BTW.

11-08-2001, 08:12 AM
U want to learn different stuff, but u need to start from scratch with a lot off stuff. Last year I had never ever used a computer for anything else than games. Now I'm dually learning Max and Maya (MAX for games, so concetrating on low-poly modelling there, and subdivisions on Maya) ... but I gotta hurry. At my part-time work I'm learning flash, html, xml and then they want to use databases ... argghh !!! I'm at 25% of AS now ... I guess ... and my math absolutely sucks ! I'm no programmer ... (and they want me to learn PHP ... fools !)

I attended 2 art schools by now, and only met about 3 other students who could actually draw anatomically correct humans ... even when there's a model posing, most people don't see it (probably cuz they are to obsessed with color and stop thinking about why things are lighter or darker ...) Even a lot of art teachers can't. I think that's weird. They're the ones who r supposed to teach us, right ? Anyway, what kind of job r u looking for ?

11-08-2001, 08:28 AM
Exactly! Sooo much to learn to make a decent buck in this world, designers make jack without new media or programming knowledge and its just damn hard to find a 3D job not in cali. Maya subdivisions rock eh!! Love them. Im so used to the spacebar interface and pull out menus and the way the hotkeys are setup that when i open max it just takes so long. I evne set up the hotkeys in max like mays but it still wasnt the same. Recently Ive been concentrating mroe on good UV creation (just realized SOOOO important anywhere).

Where do you work? Sounds like your gettting some good hands on experience. Thats what I need, learning programming is hard without actually using it. I'm no programming either, the most i've ever done is HTML and CSS. I get the concepts of actionscript and javascript fine and can remember things like objects, variables, etc but when I want to make something I have no clue realy where to start or how to combine things.

Oh man we had lots of human drawing classes, i didnt put any up on my site though, most wehre real fast drawings. They liked us to do real fast sketches because you have to concentrate on the whole figure rather than a part. Most was done in charcoal, conte or the such so taht just like you said, you draw the contrasts. Humans can be challenging though because of how skin is laid over muscles and bone and how it stretches. And teachers that can't draw, many of the 3d teachers at our school sucked at drawing, although this painitng professor i had KICKED ASS!!! He was one of those asian guys that can just drawthings really fast and make them look perfect. What schools you at or went to?

Well job im lookin for now is mostly gonna be in web / graphic or flash design. Im really solid in all three exept in programming part. I am more of a designer and layout artist than backend. I was originally looking for 3D but many of the jobs just seem to require yeras of experience or published games under your belt etc. I got one favorable response from a company in TX but for thier next game and I cant wait that long. So the search continues. I applied to five design companies today and im crossin my fingers. Right now im doing freelance and got a few jobs lined up but in the dry spells it sucks, need something stable yaknow? im confident i'll find something, all of us that are good at what we do will, just takes time.

11-08-2001, 09:06 AM
They do that EVERYWHERE ! model shifts in position every 5 minutes and ur charcoaling everything under it (u need every second so u pre-apply paper to ur boeard, but halfway during ur class u find out u applied less than needed, so u reapply new paper, but by the time ur finished the model already shifted to a new position ... (I got to skip that class last year (heh heh). Just conviced the teacher I needed the time elsewhere and didn't needed the class (actually I did, but more advanced classes, like muscle-fat-skin movement, but they don't teach u that anywhere)

I attended BMT which is short for Beeld en Media Technology (it's dutch for Image and Media Technology - a study focussing on animation, classic and 3d aided - the latter in ur last 2 years though ... ) but I stopped cuz they weren't going fast enough in my perspective ... or came up with interesting projects ... (a side study had human emotions and expressions, we had food and drinks ...) Then I went to DVTG (design for virtual theatre and games) which sounded REALLY promissing. They talked about storytelling, theatre concepts with newe media and video games. I thought : WOW ! That's exactly what I'm looking for ! And what the industry needs ! But I got REAL dissapointed. They had like 3 teachers, 1 of them hates video games and SciFi. Can u believe that ? He actually thought that everything he didn't like, can't be good. Never occurred to him that he just lacks perspective. All kinds of stuff were popping up (like no classes in interactivity or game whatsoever) only very basic 3d classes (straight from internet tutorials). Most classmates knew more about it than the teachers ! That's so disscouraging ! And I don't want classes from internet tutorials ... I didn't spend 3000 bucks for that ! I can read those from my home !

So I'm looking for a job I really want now. (I almost applied to Konami as an artist, but didn't send it at the last moment. Didn't consider myself up to the task (I saw the entries later ... and was amazed at how ... improfessional ... most work was. ) Style is good, but c'mon ! Everybody does the same thing ! In comics its Jim Lee's style and in video games most of 'em either go the Dragonball Z/Chrono Trigger way or the Evangelion/MAcross way (don't get me wrong, I love animes, but always prefer the original. New people oughta try to be new. U know ... at least try. I know, not everybody is gonna be an orignal, but most people don't even try !

ehmm ... we're kinda bogging this thread. perhaps we oughta continue per mail, if u'd like. my mail is :
[email protected]

And yes ... we need good UV ! It's highly underrated, but a good UV makes texturing so much easier (and is the only way to get accurate textures anyway. )

Did u try one of those agencies ? Most company don't react to open solicitors, but will ask one of those agencies to look for them... very weird, cuz they take contact fee's etc. and about 40% of ur salary or so. But might be handy when u don't have actual field experience like us. (how do u get it anyway... most jobs ask for 3 years of experience and at least 1 game, but to work at one u need that experience ... what a stupid circle !)